What Does the Bible Teach Us About Wealth?
November 26th, 2007 | Michael Q. Pink
Recently I read an outstanding book by John Muratori called Rich Church Poor Church addressing the issue of money and Christianity, why the wicked prosper (and so many Christians don’t) along with twelve laws of wealth building that will help anyone get ahead in this world. (We will be offering a FREE copy of that book to our subscribers shortly in a special Christmas offer so be watching for details in early December.) I was so moved by what I read and thought it would be so helpful to our community of Christians in the business arena that I asked John to write our blogs for the next few sessions so you could get a taste of what I have partaken. Drink deeply and please pass on your comments…
What Does the Bible Teach Us About Wealth?
This question recently appeared on a popular Internet forum. The answers, apparently from Christians, reveal a somewhat limited and perhaps skewed picture of how some believers view earthly prosperity.
Here are a few of those answers:
“Jesus wants us to store our treasure in heaven.”
“The blessings of God come with great wealth, but not money. It comes with the power of eternal life, peace and serenity and most of all love.”
“Jesus said, it is easier for a camel to fit through a pinhole than for a rich man to get into heaven.”
Most of these positions were birthed during the Puritan movement, where financial prosperity was viewed as a hindrance to spirituality. However, proper biblical interpretation reveals that there are two sides of the same coin. For years the church has been unable to reconcile spirituality with prosperity. How does one run after God, yet still be wealthy?
Well, if the Jews prospered and flourished for 3000 years, without ever having a country to call home, how is it that the Church has remained so poor, even in the Church Age? Could it be that we lack the spiritual discernment necessary to understand God’s full provision for us? And as a result, has the Church adopted a “Poverty Mentality?”
A quick look at any standard dictionary will tell you that “poverty” is most often defined in monetary terms - the state of having little or no money and few or no material possessions.
Now let me suggest an alternate definition. Poverty is not the state of not having. Rather, poverty is the fear of not getting. This causes you to hold on tightly to what you have. Poverty is not a state of being. It is a state of mind.
Look to Proverbs 11:24-25 and you’ll find biblical support for this new definition:
There is that scattereth, and yet increaseth; and there is that withholdeth more than is meet, but it tendeth to poverty. The liberal soul shall be made fat: and he that watereth shall be watered also himself. (KJV)
It is naive to think that God takes pleasure in the humiliation and poverty of His servants. The Scriptures declare that God expects fruit, multiplication, and prosperity from His servants and takes pleasure in their prosperity. In fact, rebuking the wicked servant who was unfruitful with money. To me the argument about prosperity is nonsensical considering the Bible lays the foundation for prosperity, economics and capitalism. Wealth is power, and its highest use is in the advancement of God’s Kingdom.
John Louis Muratori is a sought-after speaker with a unique message that crosses denominational and cultural barriers. He is a recognized authority in organizational management and strategic planning, advising numerous agencies including the Department of Homeland Security and the Department of Mental Health. John has consulted many national ministries and mentors CEO’s, millionaires, and ministers across the nation. John is the founder and president of multiple companies and non-profit corporations. John is the Sr. Pastor of Calvary Life Family Worship Center in Cheshire, CT. He is also the Executive Director of Turning Point Christian Center, a nationally acclaimed faith-based substance abuse rehabilitation program. John has authored several books, including Seven Women Shall Take Hold of One Man and Rich Church Poor Church. He resides with his wife Carmela and two boys in Connecticut.
November 26th, 2007 at 6:45 am
I have already been stirred up in my Spirit. Can not wait to read that book. I strongly believe that God delights in the prosperity of his progeny.
Moses, from Uganda - Africa.
November 26th, 2007 at 6:46 am
There is that scattereth, and yet increaseth; and there is that withholdeth more than is meet, but it tendeth to poverty. The liberal soul shall be made fat: and he that watereth shall be watered also himself. (KJV)
Forgive me Lord for holding on to what I have in fear…I ask for your forgiveness and mercy. Help me Lord be a giver with a cheerfull heart.
November 26th, 2007 at 7:54 am
It is time the truth was taught on this subject in churches across the nations. We see it on Christian Tv, in books, but the opposite view still comes from the pulpit. I wonder why?
November 26th, 2007 at 8:10 am
Greetings!
I agree that God expects us to be prosperous and this will occur naturally as we are good stewards of what He has given us and we tithe. He has blessed my husband & I greatly as we are generous with our money and we are wise in the spending of it. Jeremiah 29 states rather clearly that God is for our being prosperous in every part of our lives. I also believe it is the church’s responsibility to love others with our money. If the church was doing her job properly, could it be possible that government welfare would not be necessary? What better way to evangelize than to be generous meeting folks needs inside and out? God is creative and will make creative ways to bless others thru spreading the Gospel of our Christ Jesus not just in word, but more thru example! The more I get to know Him, the more exciting it is to be a Christian who rightly divides the truth! God is so cool!!
November 26th, 2007 at 9:51 am
Michael,
Thanks for tackling the tough issues. I believe that through the excesses of some on TV, the enemy would get us to move away from this issue and throw the baby out with the bathwater, for fear of being lumped in together with those who promote excess. I’m praying I do not do that!
Yesterday a guest speaker at our church talked about this issue some, that of the excesses of people on TV saying if you give this to us, this will happen to you. I believe in that principle. However, his take is that these folks could demonstrate their belief in what they were saying by asking people to call in, and then giving to their callers! That would demonstrate true faith that God would supply all needs. I’m not denigrating those who ask for support, it is Biblical to do so. This was just another take on it.
Blessings,
Dennis
November 26th, 2007 at 10:13 am
John needs to read up on the Puritans, who were mostly farmers, businessmen and entrepreneurs. Soli Deo Gloria was one of the principals which changed the view of work in the world. All things done to God’s glory which included all callings!
greg
November 26th, 2007 at 10:27 am
Thank you so much for these revelations!!!!!!!!! I truly needed these encouraging words today. My husband and I are praying for a financial break through. We were at one time totally debt free but are now facing more debt than we’ve ever seen due to some health issues as well as other things.
We have been sowing seeds as God leads and are trusting God for healing in finances as well as other areas. God is an awesome God!!
Debra Arnold: Fort Valley Ga.
November 26th, 2007 at 10:31 am
Michael,
What a issue. I am not sure anyone can do it justice through a blog though. I know you will have comments from all over the spectrum.
Everyone should be careful about who and what book they read on this subject because of all the new age stuff and the prosperity stuff around. Everyone needs to read and hear and then not just except it but do like the Bareans did and see if it matches up with what God says. Do not take one verse but read the whole bible, pray and seek God’s face and them come up with your answer.
Many years ago, Ray Steadmen, a preacher and great bible teacher preached a sermon called Poor-Rich Church. You can find it at http://www.raystedman.org/revelation/4195.html.
Here is one small paragraph
“You say, ‘I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.’ But you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked.” (Revelation 3:17 NIV)
“What a sad condition! There is a big difference between “you say,” and “you are.” Our Lord points this difference out. This is the “Faithful and True witness” speaking, the one who tells the whole truth, even though it hurts. This church at Laodicea was, to use a popular expression, “fat, dumb and happy.” It was smug. It was self-sufficient. It was complacent. They had plenty of money. Perhaps they had beautiful buildings, gifted preachers, a great choir, a great organ, and the respect of the community. They thought they were doing well. But when Jesus looks at it, he says, “You are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked.” Why such a difference in these two views? It is because they were being measured by two different standards.”
Many people have been following what is going on at Oral Roberts. And the fire Ken Blanchard is getting endorsing all the new age stuff. Tragedy when someone in leadership, ie pastor, falls into what Paul warned Timothy about.
A couple of books I would recommend are Money, Possessions and Eternity by Randy Alcorn, anything by Larry Burkett, John Piper’s book’s Desiring God and Don’s Waste Your Life, and most importantly read the Bible with an open mind and ask God to reveal to us what He says about wealth. I believe to many people read the Bible with their mind already made up
God bless with this one and I am curious to read all the comments.
November 26th, 2007 at 10:45 am
Way to go!!!!! Now you are beginning to define what I’ve known in my heart and observed for many years, but was contradictory to what everyone and every denomination, except the Jewish people, were teaching. The great part about this is that in eschewing most churches and churchy people, I’ve learned to go to God directly to get “re-trained”, and allow Him to answer my questions. Just recently, He has begun to guide me to the teachers who I see are in agreement with the Truths He is giving me…like you. I can’t get enough of what He is imparting. Thank you.
November 26th, 2007 at 10:57 am
I hear a lot of stuff about the Jewish people. Remember folks, God has harden their hearts and most of them are lost and not in Christ. One day God will remove the harden but as of now they are sinners. Yes, they are chosen and you to are chosen and drafted in if you have accepted Christ.
I would rather be the poorest and most persecuted Christian than the richest, lost Jew.
November 26th, 2007 at 11:01 am
The claim about the Puritans needs to be qualified. Many of the great puritans understood the principles of entrepreneurship and wealth accumulation (for Kingdom purposes and God’s glory). Taking verses from Proverbs would allow for the endorsement of infinite theories, not all Biblical. God does bless his people, spiritually and physically (which includes material and economic blessing). However, we should shy away from any teaching that gaurantees material blessing because of Godliness.
With that said, the Church has sabotaged itself with stinkin’ thinkin’ on this subject and we need to take back the channels of power and wealth.
November 26th, 2007 at 11:04 am
Thanks to you Michael and John.
This topic isn’t going away. Just look at the vulnerability of American Capitalism…teetering once again - lots of countries dumping the dollar and our Fed will probably futher devalue the dollar by lowering interest rates.
Where this leads is to an enormous wake up call in the form of a recession or worse. Why? Because the pursuit of security via Capitalism is idolatry. While Capitalism rewards certain virtues generally, it also rewards many vices and ultimately cannot be said to be biblical. I highly recommend the short book Cash Values by Craig M. Gay. This is the best explanation of where our monetary policy as a nation has taken us and why. It is not a political book nor is it particularly religious (thankfully), but a great worldview analysis of what happens when nearly all value is measured in terms of the dollar.
It is sad to say but a lot of our economic hardships (most yet to come) would have been dramatically lessened if we hadn’t killed 30 million of our own children before they were born. Think of the lost productivity at every level. Possibly the cure for cancer or heart disease etc….traded for convenience and so-called sexual freedom. Even a communist would see this as abhorrent - losing all those tax payers! Don’t think our economy isn’t dramatically effected by our morality - there is no divide. “Where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.”
Think God doesn’t see this? Think again. And, here comes the consequences. Biblically speaking wealth generation is not about currency stockpiling or the speculation of 401k’s. It is about the power to create wealth. The power to create wealth lies in positioning yourself, your business, or your country to be the “ark” that everyone needs when the flood arrives. Where’s that gopher wood?
November 26th, 2007 at 11:21 am
It’s the love of money that is the root of all evil Not the money it’s self. Christians need to get out of that poverty mentality it shames God who is a giving God and a loving Father, for His children to go to a restautant and instead of being the best tippers they leave a bible tract. That waitress can’t feed her baby with a bible tract! And it makes it harder for the next Christian that comes along to witness to her.
Think about it, you just gave her the impression that all Christians are poor just like her so, what do you have to offer her? Now there is nothing wrong with leaving a tract as long as you put a big tip in it. She may just read it instead of cussing you. Wouldn’t that be a better way to sow a seed? Which was the intended purpose of the tract, Right?
In this world money talks and if you don’t have enough faith to walk in the Blessings that God has planned for you than just leave the tracts in your pocket and eat at a fast food place! Or better yet, go through the drive through and take your food home and open up your bible and feed your faith and body at the same time!
The waitress will thank better of you and make witnessing easier for other Christians.
Didn’t intend to hurt any feelings but, did intend to step on a few toes!
With Love, Christopher
November 26th, 2007 at 12:05 pm
I believe this is a well-balanced approach to prosperity within the kingdom. As Christians, we must stand up and claim what is rightfully ours, but even more important, God wants us to have it more than we do.
“Ye have not, because ye ask not”, it does not come much clearer than that.
November 26th, 2007 at 12:49 pm
A few other thoughts on this:
Paul commands Timothy to tell those who are rich in this age not to put their hope in wealth, but in God, and to share with those in need. Clearly here Paul acknowledges that some will be rich in this age, and gives a safeguard for those that are. He acknowledges there are pressures the come with wealth, and instructions on how to deal with it. And it’s not those who have wealth who ensare themselves. It’s those who want to become rich. Big difference.
In the OT the Israelites are commanded to not think that by their own power or strength that they were made wealthy, but that it was God who gave them the power to create wealth, to confirm His covenant with them. God, who is unchanging, does give power to create wealth. Some will say, then what about the poor? Many of the poor, e.g., in Africa, have been oppressed, ultimately by the devil, working through others. Considering Zimbabwe (spelling?). Certainly there were probably issues of racism there with the prior white ruling class, yet the current ruler, Mugabe, has run that country into the ground to the point where it cannot sustain itself, even though prior to his rule the country had a thriving agricultural economy. It seems the poor are under oppression of various sorts.
In the Kingdom of Heaven, there is no lack. That doesn’t mean everyone becomes fabulously wealthy. I believe it does mean that we have more than what we need, so that we may share with others that are in need, over and above our tithe. I think it also means that we are wise stewards, and that we wisely invest to prepare for our own retirement, so as not to be a burden on our children. I believe in Proverbs it talks about laying up treasure for children’s children. I’d love to be able to leave both a rich spiritual and economic inheritance for my grandchildren.
Blessings,
Dennis
November 26th, 2007 at 1:25 pm
Here is my favorite verse in the whole Bible concerning poverty & riches:
“For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sakes He became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich.” 2 Corinthians 8:9
I am so thankful that our Lord Jesus gave up everything for us that we might have everything in Him. To be with Him, behold Him, reflect Him, to be conformed to His image and to follow after Him is true riches and could mean that we may have no place to lay our head. However, our Heavenly Father knows what we need before we even ask. This includes our daily bread, and the resources to give abundantly to others. If we are occupied with pursuing Him, seeking first the Kingdom of God, then all these things will be added to us and our God will supply all our need according to His riches in glory. Certainly, our God is not a God of scarcity, but abundance. He does desire fruitfulness. Anything that is done to acquire material wealth should be done to build the Kingdom of God, not to build bigger barns for ourselves. Neither poverty nor wealth are, in themselves, virtues, but to know Christ and His ways. Whether I have the widow’s mite, or the wealth of Solomon, I pray that as I learn and grow in His principles concerning money, that my heart is directed to see how much I can give away, not how much I can get to consume upon my own lusts. I would love nothing more than to have enough to live on 10% and give away 90%. That is my goal financially.
I guess my point is - pursue Christ, not wealth. Yet do not settle for less than God’s best for each one. Do not judge the poor man in his poverty. Do not judge the rich man in His wealth. May they both pursue Christ with all their heart, mind, soul and strength and fulfill the destiny and calling that our Abba, Father his put upon their lives.
Thank you, Michael, for continuing to provide a forum with open, honest dialog on this issue to enable us to come to an understanding of our Father’s mind & heart on these issues.
November 26th, 2007 at 1:46 pm
Michael,
I just read Randy Alcorn’s book, “The Treasure Principle” and so this message from John Moratori was very timely for me. Because of God’s blessing and having successfully applied business principles that you have pulled out of scripture and taught, I now find myself in the position of needing to determine how much of my income that I should keep since I do not need most of it. My wife and I have made some eternal investments and intend to do much more as we maintain a modest life style.
Blessed,
Bob Brooks
November 26th, 2007 at 3:54 pm
In reading some of the responses generated from this entry, I am amazed at how this topic of wealth seems to stir up much debate and negative connotations within the Body of Christ. I have had the pleasure of reading Muratori’s book “Rich Church Poor Church” and I must say that I have yet to read a book that seems to have a firm grip on God’s purpose and intent for money as this one does. The author provides a direction that I have not seen in Christian Wealth books including the two mentioned earlier- and don’t worry there is an abundance of scriptural evidence to satisfy any concern.
As a financial advisor and business consultant, it is refreshing to find a book that is able to biblically balance spirituality and prosperity. The amount of Biblical revelation and insight into God’s covenant people (which is transferred to every believer) is absolutely groundbreaking. This book isn’t about the kind of car you drive or the house you live in, or the size of your personal bill-fold, its about God’s purposes and agenda for his 21st century people.
It’s impossible for any blog entry to unravel the depth of information and revelation contained in “Rich Church, Poor Church” I encourage all of you to invest in this book, you will not be disappointed.
- Peter
November 26th, 2007 at 5:29 pm
I didn’t read the new book, but because i have the opportunity, i will say what i am getting from the Scripture. It may be weard and not convinient for most of us, but the example of the first church was to be followed. Yes, I know all the interpretations, explanations, etc. that it was only then.
The Lord God almighty wants us to depend on him, not in our abilities of doing things and solving problems. Depending on God means alawys thinking of others, puting others ahead of us, and really working on our salvation with fear and tremblemet (do you know where this verse is?), looking for the things from above. There are still religions on this earth that practise what we, followers of Christ are suppose to do.
They meet very often to share, learn, eat etc. together, and once a year a number of families are chosen to be blessed by the rest of the community. They do business together, and they help each other to open and to do business, while the christians are scatered, working hard to prove themselves, how God blessed them, because if you are prosperous you are a good Christian. We live in fear and in want, very careful to be in the will of God, but we have to prove that we have more and better than the brother or sister.
Where is the difference between the world and the followers of Christ if among us we are divided looking for only my family interest, ignoring the bust that I can give to another family, or person to get ahead in life and to become more independent, even though I don’t know them, and it looks like they don’t have a lot to offer?
We know that God forbid lending with interest, but now we have Christian comp. lending money with interest, we have Christian banks, …….
We need to aknowledge the sistem we live in and to do our best, but we have to keep the prospective of the parts of a body working together,with respect of each other functions. Otherwise we ignore the head, our Lord and saviour, the son of the living GOd. Jesus died for souls, not for our well being. He said “who wants to follow me, ……………” we know the rest and also he said “who loses his life….”
WE are at war and the wealth and prosperity will never be the tools to conquer or a sign that really God blessed me. His eye is on the sparrow…..but I am not sure if He is watching me?
I discovered a verse that nobody ever teach about : 1 COr 15:19
It is not a sin to work and become rich, it is a sin to reduce the new life in Christ to only earthly things.
We are getting ready to live eternally in the splendors of the king of kings………………………………………………………………………………
…
November 26th, 2007 at 6:34 pm
I totally agree with this view. The word is very clear on God’s position of our obtaining wealth. It is to advance the Kingdom of God on earth. The Bible states “how can they go unless they are sent?” Someone has to have money in order to send those who carry the Good News around the world.
November 26th, 2007 at 9:27 pm
There is a lot of good and bad teaching on money and wealth that is lifted from the Bible. Thus the body of Christ has been subjected to a spiritual and financial struggle that is man made and has nothing to do with the truths concerning money and wealth revealed in the word of God. We need to learn the primary truths and base our teaching and living on them when we are building the Kingdom of God. It’s been said there are more references to wealth and money than sin. Yet, a large majority of people inside and outside of the church hold on the the un-truth that equates money as being sinful. For the sake of time and space please consider this as a foundational truth which must be built upon: Do not forget God. Go back into Deuteronomy and look at what God shared with Moses; not just for that time and season but these were His eternal thoughts. Deuteronomy 8.16-18 (NIV) “He (God) gave you manna to eat in the desert, something your fathers had never known, to humble and TEST you so that in the end it might GO WELL with you. You may say to yourself, ‘My power (personal strength and ability) and the strength of my hands have produced this wealth for me.’ BUT REMEMBER the Lord your God, for it is HE WHO GIVES you the ability to produce wealth, (THIS IS FOR MANY IN THE BODY OF CHRIST WHERE THEY END THIS VERSE; BECAUSE IT FITS THEIR OWN PERSONAL THEOLOGY, but please read on) and so confirms His covenant (this covenant includes the wealth being used for the purposes of God, for remember a covenant is aa agreement between two signatories; in this case the children of Israel and God.), which He (God) swore to your forefathers, as it is today.” This command was given directly TO the children of Israel, but it is FOR the body of Christ today as we are told to “make disciples of ALL nations today.
As I travel thru and work with churches, pastors, and the people of India, it is very apparent that much of the poverty in the Indian church is a by product of the false teaching brought in by the western church. If we are ALL to see the nations being made into disciples we must be delivered from the spirit of poverty and being filled with the Holy Spirit we begin to openly demonstrate this by manifesting the “mind of Christ” in ALL things.
Jesus said this FOR us just as well as He spoke it TO His first disciples “So in EVERYTHING, do to others what you would have them do to you, for THIS sums up the Law and the Prophets.” Matthew 7.12
Shouldn’t we as “little Christs” (Christian) do the same. In His love and truth. DAF
November 26th, 2007 at 11:13 pm
I believe so far that most of us are on the same page. (agree) That it is God’s will for christians to prosper. Now there is a verse in the bible that Jesus said I have no place to lay my head, meaning that He didn’t own a home. Some preachers will use that to back up their poverty message and turn around and ask for an offering! However, they usually can’t afford to preach very long. THANK GOD!
Jesus wasn’t poor. He had a treasurer, He wore a seamless robe that they gambled over verses slpiting up. I’m sure someone made or bought that robe just for HIM. Would it have been a sin if He bought it Himself? NO I think NOT!
A poor man doesn’t need a treasurer and anyone on a mission traveling like He was doesn’t need a house. He knew His destiny when He was 13 years old. He knew how to walk by faith and not only for Himself but, for His deciples also!
I refuse to believe that Jesus and His deciples had to camp out in the winter time without even a tent! The bible leaves out a lot of things like where they slept every night and what they ate every meal which is probably a good thing because, people would just make a religion out of it.
The bottom line of my rambeling is Jesus was not poor, He was our example of how to live and before He ascended into heaven He said greater works than these that He did we should do. SO, shame on us. If we did his works there wouldn’t be people going to hell and starving to death because, there are more of us than Him and all He did was teach a lesson about the goodnes of God and pray over a few loaves and fishes and fed more than 5,000 people. Not just once but twice! Can you see a pattern here prospertiy includes money but, it is not dependent on it.
Keep in mind I my have one finger pointing at you but, I have three pointing back at me.
All in love, Christopher
PS. I wish this thing had spell check!
November 27th, 2007 at 12:15 am
One of my favorite verses from the Bible regarding wealth is Proverbs 13:22 - A good man leaveth an inheritance to his children’s children: and the wealth of the sinner is laid up for the just.
November 27th, 2007 at 11:21 am
Mike
As others have pointed out, this is a very controversial area. I think the root issue is - “Where is your heart?”. People want wealth for many reasons, but Jesus said, “Seek FIRST, the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things will be added unto you”. I don’t believe poverty is a sign of advanced spirituality, any more than I believe wealthiness is a sign. Paul worked as a tentmaker, and didn’t take any money from offerings -even though it was his due, but he also said the labourer is worthy of his hire. Before God can entrust anyone with wealth, they need refining by fire (of His Holy Spirit) in order that their motives be pure, that they use it as He directs, and they keep Him FIRST in their lives, so that they don’t become attached o wealth and become lovers of money as Paul warned Timothy. I ‘ll be frank, I am not wealthy monetarily, I would welcome wealthiness, but at this point, I am not sufficiently refined motive-wise, and admit that I need to pursue God more, and develop our relationship more, grow in my walk with Him. We as Christians are privy to the same mentality as the world if we are not careful. There’s a reason why Napoleon Hill’s book “Think and Grow Rich”, and Robert Rimmer’s book, “Looking Out For Number One”, were so successful. Nowadays, the prosperity school of Christianity, appears to be of the same school but they call it “Believe and Grow Rich” instead.I heartily agree with previous posters of comments, that with so much poverty in the world and even in our own countries, the wealth given to those who have, should be used to help those who don’t have - not to buy 18000 sq ft homes, new yachts, etc.
God wants His children to enjoy the fruits of His blessing them financially, but not to hoard treasures here on earth.
November 27th, 2007 at 1:38 pm
quote That it is God’s will for Christians to prosper.” A thousand times no. Not everyone. Some yes but not everyone. And if God does not prosper you it is because of lack of faith. Through out the Bible, God prospered some and did others.
Prosperity teaching promotes less faith in the promises of God to be for us what money can’t be.
The reason the writer to the Hebrews tells us to be content with what we have is that the opposite implies less faith in the promises of God. He says, “Keep your life free from love of money, and be content with what you have, for he has said, ‘I will never leave you nor forsake you.’ So we can confidently say, ‘The Lord is my helper; I will not fear; what can man do to me?’” (Hebrews 13:5-6).
If the Bible tells us that being content with what we have honors the promise of God never to forsake us, why would we want to teach people to want to be rich?
November 27th, 2007 at 6:27 pm
I was left alone after a divorce, there was some money left over after I had bought myself a smaller place. However, I was not in faith, very traumatised and not tithing and I was eating my seed! I was convicted about this from Malachi and started tithing although, in the natural there was no income to do this. However I did it and the Lord has truly blessed me. Bob Gass on one of his teachings says that if we need more harvest then we have to put in more seed. It is the law of sowing and reaping. The measure that we give out is the measure that is given back to us.
November 27th, 2007 at 10:06 pm
I really appreciate his perspective on poverty. Paul learned that it was his ability to live in his position in Christ that allowed him to say ” I have learned to be content in whatever state I am in.” I think we have to come to that point where where we learn to know Jesus is all we really need. Phil. 3:10 I appreciate you my brother. Your love and freindship have had a tremendous impact on me. Robert Ps. 86:11
November 27th, 2007 at 11:36 pm
This book is timely and thought provoking. Just a few minutes ago, I was reading Revelation [first 5 chapters] for my personal devotion, and what a coincidence with Kern’s observation!
This book is going to draw lot of responses both for and against Christians being “prosperous” on this earth. The key is our heart ["Where is it focused - is it focused on God or on Money"?] That is what God is interested in.
Earning money is a financial skill both Christians and non-Christians are mastering and proving. God is showering rain on “Believers and non-believers alike”. The principles are the same [like medicine or engineering]. Both believers and non-believers are acquiring and mastering the prosperity skills and reaping the rewards.
Once again James comes to mind - “You do not get because you do not ask in “faith”. Even if you ask, you do not get because you want to spend it to fulfil your lusts. He talks about our motives.
In my opinion, I believe God never stops Christians to go out and work with their hands and minds and to learn the art of earning money. However, if a Christian engages in “Making” money and putting his / her trust in it as the end of everything, that takes his / her heart away from God - surely. Heavy involvement in “Makign money” surely takes one’s time away from his / her family and also from God. World is full of examples for this.
Instead, we need to be “heavenly minded” because it is written “rich man is nothing and poor man is nothing - both will come to an end”. Peter says the whole earth and heavens will come to an end. Why put our trust in propsperity? God said to Abraham “I AM your great reward”. When we go to be with HIM, we are going to see that FULL reward in HIS Holy presence.
Finally, it is good for a Christian to understand the meaning of money and the principles that govern it. Money in itself is inert but is a medium to exchange goods and services which in turn are produced by human hands and minds who invested their life time in it. The raw materials, products and services and those [people] who produce them] are ALL the creation of God. We need to be thankful to HIM and whatever we do, if we do not aim to bring HIM glory but are filled with self-preservation, lust, greed, and self-fulfillment, we are entering in to the territory of “idolatry”.
David never worked hard to become rich - he just took his primitive musical instruments and went after his sheep and praised God by the side of the brooks. What next - from zero to the position of a king whose gold, silver, bronze, herds and all that wealth [is recorded in Chronicles]. YET, David preferred instead to “live in God’s premises / house forever”.
God made an eternal covenant to establish his “throne forever”. It is important for a Christian to get his perspective and motives right. Our heritage is “mind boggling” and we are going to see to appreciate it - How about “Sitting next to Jesus on HIS throne! IF WE OVERCAME” How do we compare to “making Money” on this earth!
God bless you all.
November 28th, 2007 at 12:04 am
this note is for Elena:
The verse about “working out our salvation with fear and trembling” can be found in Phillippians 2: 12.
November 28th, 2007 at 4:28 am
I am following the lack of richness at church and this topic is very interesting congratulations, I will be ansious to receive more info.
My God bless you.
Apostol
Jorge D. Diaz
Ministerios Internacionales Manantiales de Vida
P.O. box 40160
mesa az 85274-0160
480-343-3115
November 28th, 2007 at 6:48 am
I also heard another teaching many years ago which commented on the scripture “the love of money is the root of all evil” saying that it means the hoarding of money is the root of all evil, meaning that we should keep giving away our time and resources. It says somewhere in the Bible “sow besides every water”. Also if we give to the poor we are lending to the Lord and the Lord is no mans debtor. I believe it depends on our heart attitude. Many Christians are in fear because of lack of trust and a poverty mentalityand the fearful end time teachings going around. I was in Charismatic church many years ago and they had the idea of prosperity. However there were other errors in this organisation such as Heavy Shepherding, Replacement Theology and Kingdom Dominion teaching. Then we were involved with a few groups who preached against this type of church and who were into legalistic Christianity or, as some would describe, “religion” which does not set anyone free or attract unbelievers either! Their favourite subjects for preaching were the end times and Israel. One of the reasons for their anti-prosperity teaching was the fact that the anti-Christ would appear on the world scene shortly and that we would all have to have the mark stamped on us. ie. 666 if we wanted to buy or sell and that if we were Christians then we were not to have this done. Therefore we would not be able to buy or sell and we would be in poverty totally trusting the Lord for everything???
Now I am working a 12 step spiritual programme, thank the Lord, and am back, thankfully, in the Church of England (after family breakdown) I believe we should be prospered for the work of the Kingdom and to get the message out to believers and non-believers that there is a God who loves us all and to trust Him daily and hourly, to get rid of negative emotions and to forgive and join with others in love speaking our own truth quietly and clearly.
November 28th, 2007 at 9:29 am
Thank you. Poverty is a curse. Also, the inordinate love of money creates an equal amount of issues. I believe that it is our definition of ‘wealth’ that is the issue. It is defined, primarily in the church by the ‘world’s standards’. It is defined by ‘things’ rather than ‘purpose’. Most of the passages I have read about wealth define its purposes. God gives us the power to get wealth -TO ESTABLISH HIS COVENANT (Deut 8:18). The wealth of the wicked is laid up for the just - SO THAT AN INHERITANCE CAN BE ESTABLISHED FOR THEIR CHILDREN’S CHILDREN (Proverbs 13:22). From our sowing we recieve all sufficiency, in all things - TO HAVE AN ABUNDANCE FOR EVERY GOOD WORK (2 Corinthians 9:6-8).
The first value for every believer must be the Lordship of Jesus Christ. He owns ‘it’ (the wealth) and us (Psalms 50:10;
November 28th, 2007 at 9:45 am
(oops I presse the wrong button, here is the remainder of my comments)
The first value for every believer must be the Lordship of Jesus Christ. He owns ‘it’ (the wealth) and us (Psalms 50:10;Haggai 2:8; 1 Corinthians 6:20). The believer who truly embraces the Lordship of Jesus Christ understands that any wealth they accumulate belongs to the Lord - not them. The Lord promises to care for us (Matthew 6:8,33). Whether I am called to raise millions of dollars, or if I simply earn enough for me and my family - it all belongs to the Lord. Anything I recieve from Him is a gift of grace - not a right of ownership.
Finally, God is not upset with us having nice things or being prosperous. It is when those things become idols that we sin. Even if one chooses to take a ‘vow of poverty’ - the very act of doing so acknowleges the ability or percieved right to prosperity. A vow of poverty or the accumulation of billions do not take the place of the complete allegience to the Lordship of Jesus Christ.
Thank you for this forum.
November 28th, 2007 at 10:16 am
Thank you for this encouragement. Through my personal experiences of the past and the first church i went to (very religious)!! Ive always felt that having lots of money was wrong. But through my struggles over many, many years (not of my own making) I realise that God wants us to excel in all areas. At present I am unemployed for about the eighth time in 9 yrs (none my fault), but I am trusting God for a better future. I was thinking about the son of Jonathan (cant spell his name) when King David called his servants to seek out anyone from Saul’s family that he could bless. And they found a son of Jonathan who was crippled. David brought him to his “banqueting table”!! Jesus is the King of Kings, so yes He is looking to bless His children, we only need to believe and expect great things materially and financially. My dream is to raise up the broken and hurting and outcasts, not only spiritually, emotionally but also to bless them materially. In the natural I have been in the wilderness for a long time, but I keep reprogramming my mind to expect wonderful things as His mercies are new every morning. I would love to have a copy of John Lois Muratori’s book please.
November 28th, 2007 at 2:20 pm
Dear Christine and others…
Please be watching your inbox Thursday, December 6th for instructions on how to receive your free copy of John Muratori’s ground breaking book. Some restrictions do apply.
Blessings, Michael
November 28th, 2007 at 5:34 pm
Michael
Thank you for letting me know how to order a FREE copy of this book. I have so many books waiting to read and vowed I would not spend any more money on books. My Life Recovery Bible is the best book I have had in a long time!
Years ago there were not all these books and big ministries.
We are living far too hectic lives as it is in the western world. Surely the Bible was enough to read with the anointing of the Holy Spirit? Some of these ministers put people off becoming Christians because of their aggressive preaching and, as someone else has said, getting people to give to their ministries and telling them that if they do so they will get a blessing! In my estimation a lot of this is coming from a place of intimidation and manipulation
Jesus is the gentle Lamb of God and Derek Prince preached many years ago that in these end times we will have to choose between having the Spirit of the Lamb in us or the Spirit of the Beast!! Derek Prince is one of the few Bible teachers who I listened to for years and learned so much.
When I left a Charismatic Church, many years ago, I was told by the leader that “I could not be one of his sheep because his sheep hear his voice”. That is arrogance and the Lord sends delusion to those with this mentality. I believe this leader actually thought that he was God! In the 12 step fellowships the newcomer is the most important person in the group and the other members are to serve the newcomer. Unfortunately in many groups the leadership is the most important and Christians are called to follow like sheep. The gospel is very SIMPLE and its really time for us to stop following big ministries around, going from one meeting to another. We need to be getting out there individually as the Holy Spirit leads, gently witnessing to others and asking for everything that we need, i.e. words of knowledge, from Him. However we need first of all to spend much time waiting on Him and meditating on His Word. I remember with embarrassment when I was a new Christian the mistakes I made in being too enthusiastic and putting people off. He gave me a vision, last year, of a uterus and the fallopian tubes and inside the uterus was a golden eagle trying to travel down the birth canal and get out. However, the eagle changed from gold to black to gold to black and gold to black and faded away! Isaiah 40 was the scripture which went with the vision. Those who wait upon the Lord will renew their strength!
November 28th, 2007 at 7:07 pm
Very intriguing, I am currently reading a book by mike murdock on wealth, i am a thither n generous giver to the things of God, yet it seems, we are constantly living from hand to mouth, any infor on wealth is timely, as i k now beyound a shadow of doubt that God doesnt want me to b poor.
Can i put my name down for the free book you are planning to give out in december, God bless u.
OluSeyi, Essex, UK
November 29th, 2007 at 12:55 am
Thanks for your honesty Oluseyi. I have lived like that all my life! Now I believe that I have been in training for the end times, as I have come to realise that ALL I am and have is found in Jesus. One time we wanted to go to help out in Mozambique. We were asking God for the fares etc (very expensive trip from NZ), and He said “Buy a house!” So we bought a rental property and the tenant is paying off the house and the trip, as we got enough loan to pay for both. One time our farm had a flood and the year’s crops were wiped out. We had $14000 of bills to pay one month. We put them on the floor, prayed over them, and the following day found $7000 in the bank - courtesy the tax refund department! The rest came in over the next 2 weeks. God is so GOOD! I believe that sometimes our ‘lack’ is training for reigning as we need to learn to trust God for the business decisions and not lean on our own understanding. (Proverbs 3:5&6) At least that’s the way I have viewed it. My lack becomes His opportunity for a supernatural solution. Also, we have had to deal with familiar spirits of poverty that have come down the family lines, and break the curse off our lives. We found Larry Huch’s book and CD study guide really great in that area.
Many blessings to everyone as we walk this amazing and fascinating faith walk together.
Chrissie, New Zealand